The moral alignment of Marvel's GLBT characters

[transemacabre]

As I mentioned in this post, it's striking and somewhat depressing how many of Marvel's GLBT characters are villains, anti-villains, or spent a substantial period of their career as villains. I feel this came about because of two reasons: firstly, that media has a long history of allowing villainous characters to display controversial or 'wicked' characteristics such as homosexuality, which would be unthinkable for heroic characters (think of all the lesbian vampires in film that appeared LONG before any lesbian could take center stage as a heroine); and secondly, because like one-fourth of these characters were outed during Fabian Nicieza's tenure on Thunderbolts, and not only is the cast of Thunderbolts comprised entirely of villains and ex-villains, Nicieza LOVES his gay characters. Seriously, if Nicieza's writing it, somebody's gonna be gay.



Just to illustrate my point, all the characters outed or implied to be GLBT by Nicieza will be marked with an asterisk (*).

VILLAINS and ANTI-VILLAINS

Electro (bisexual)
*Shinobi Shaw (bisexual)
Daken (bisexual)
*Gypsy Moth (bisexual)
*Joystick (bisexual/bicurious)
*Man-Killer (lesbian)
Machinesmith (gay)
Mystique (bisexual/bigendered)
Destiny (lesbian/bisexual). Note: Had at least one child, which implies a prior relationship with a man, but this is not neccesarily proof she was not truly a lesbian.
*Andreas von Strucker (bisexual). Note: Confirmed bisexual by Word of God.
Mephisto (bisexual/omnisexual)
*Deadpool (bicurious/bisexual)

Possibly GLBT, but not outright stated category:

*Blizzard (gay? Could definately be read as gay in his Tbolts days, although Nicieza said he really hadn't thought about it one way or the other for Donnie).

The uncategorizable category:

The Void, who on one ocassional passionately kissed his opposite number (and splinter self), the Sentry.
Purple Man, who sexually assaulted at least one male (Andreas von Strucker), but is a sexual sadist and would likely assault anyone in his thrall.

EX-VILLAINS

Moondragon (lesbian/bisexual)
Xavin (bigendered alien). Note: Only an antagonist for like half an issue.
Living Lightning (gay). Note: had prior relationships with women, so might've been bisexual, but confirmed gay by Word of God.
Kismet (transgendered).
Cloud (bigendered alien). Note: only briefly a villain.
Black Cat (bisexual)
Victoria Hand (lesbian)

HEROES and ANTI-HEROES

Phyla-Vell (lesbian/bisexual)
Karolina Dean (lesbian)
Northstar (gay)
Freedom Ring (gay)
Wiccan (gay)
Hulking (gay)
Bloke (gay)
Destroyer (gay)
Union Jack II (gay)
Flatman (gay)
Anole (gay)
*Shatterstar (gay)
*Rictor (bisexual)
Victoria Montessi (lesbian)
Nash (lesbian)
Amy Chen (lesbian)
Doop (bisexual)
Firelord (bisexual)
Hector (gay)
Julie Power (lesbian)
Phat (gay)
Vivisector (gay)
Karma (lesbian)
Greymalkin (gay)
Jennifer Kale (bisexual)
Marlo Chandler (bisexual/bicurious)

Possibly GLBT, but not outright stated category:

Storm (bisexual? Her relationship with Yukio suggests yes)
Hercules (bisexual? Hinted at by Northstar's reaction at his funeral).
*Gambit (bisexual? Certainly willing enough to kiss Courier).
Jazinda (bisexual? Seems to be in love with She-Hulk)
Thundra (lesbian? Finds it "a pity" that She-Hulk and Jazinda aren't together)

The uncategorizable category:

Korg and Hiroim (definately in a relationship, but as Korg is an alien from a monogendered species, I'm not really sure what this would be classified under. Maybe just queer?)
Courier (male mutant, currently trapped in female form. Apparently straight, but kissed Gambit quite willingly one time.)
Starhawk II (actually two beings, a male and female, simultaneously sharing a single body. Tough to classify)
The Sentry (see: The Void)

Comments

[kirke-novak.livejournal.com]

Was Deadpool confirmed 100%? I know there was A LOT of subtext but never any statement.

[transemacabre.livejournal.com]

As he's outright told Thor he was attracted to him, I'd say this is a definate. Deadpool's bicurious (or most likely, his sexuality is simply unusual) at least.

[kirke-novak.livejournal.com]

There better bring that Deadpool film soon, so the crossovers could begin!

[mike-smith.livejournal.com]

Isn't Deadpool nuts? I mean, if it was any other character, I'd take him at his word, but this just sounds like typical Deadpool-schtick to me. The whole time he was hitting on Black Widow during the Thunderbolts crossover, I couldn't tell if he actually had feelings for her or if it was some elaborate, off-the-cuff gag he thought up to amuse himself. He may not even know if he was kidding.

He may very well be bisexual, but as long as the writers turn everything he says and does into a joke, we'll never know for sure. Is Loki still Deadpool's father? Was he ever really his father to begin with? We'll never know because it was just an excuse to have Deadpool look like Tom Cruise for six issues.

[transemacabre.livejournal.com]

I get what you're saying, and its obvious that Deadpool finds himself attracted to a pretty random collection of people (Bea Arthur, Siryn, and Thor? WTF?), but there's been enough hints that he finds guys attractive that it'd be pretty dumb of me to leave him off. I think bicurious is a reasonable guess.

And yes, Deadpool's behavior is played for laughs, but its not like anyone dismisses his attraction to Siryn because he's crazy. Hell, most of the others are fairly crazy (The Sentry and The Void quite possibly trump Deadpool in the Crazy O'Lympics).

[mike-smith.livejournal.com]

I dismissed his attraction to Siryn because it was made to look like a total goof. What was she, like 19 years old? Then he gets his own book and she's barely in it. Deadpool's new love interest: Death. (Bi-curious? Moar liek DIE-curious, amirite?) The only difference between Deadpool/Siryn and Deadpool/Black Widow is that the joke was still new when they did it with Siryn.

The Sentry and The Void quite possibly trump Deadpool in the Crazy O'Lympics

Sure, but you've got those two down as uncategorizable, which I think is appropriate. The thing is, your whole argument is based on how many villains and heroes are LBGT, but the very tally seems flawed. Daken's made out with dudes on-panel, right? Hulkling and Wiccan had a whole issue where they came out of the closet. Northstar literally shouted "I am gay!" from the mountaintops. That's a long way away from the Blizzard being "read as gay", or Joystick hanging out at a strip club, or Deadpool saying he'd knock boots with Uncle Thor.

I mean, what's the threshold for a comic character definitely being LBGT? Baron Zemo fondled Strucker's balls that one time. He deserves a spot on your list more than the Blizzard. There has to be a point where the writer stops teasing the audience and starts making it a serious aspect of the character.

[transemacabre.livejournal.com]

Re: Zemo, well of course my interpretation is that he's, uh, not exactly straight, but its hard to make a strong argument for that based on panel evidence, and while you could perceive Blizzard as being "coded" (intentionally or not) as gay, Zemo is just coded as being... Zemo. And so many people have fondled Andreas that if he spat in a petrie dish he could start a whole new civilization. (Really, its clearly meant to be intimidation on Zemo's part).

Back later when I have more time to answer.

[minutia-r.livejournal.com]

There's also the fact that Marvel characters change alignments like most people change undershirts. Seriously, I think it was a kink of Chris Claremont's.

I do notice that the villainous characters on your list are more likely to be bisexual, and the heroic ones more likely to be monosexual. It's the Depraved Bisexual trope!

[transemacabre.livejournal.com]

Oh yes! Daken IS the Depraved Bisexual trope personafied. Also notice that the GLBT heroes are overall MUCH more obscure than the GLBT villains (Mystique, Deadpool, Electro, and Black Cat are all well-known from the movies/tv shows, Daken headlines his own book, and Mephisto, while not a popular villain, is a major league heavy-hitter). The villains are also allowed to get away with being much more blatantly sexual. It's ricockulous that Daken is straight up banging dudes in his solo book, and Wiccan and Hulking have never kissed on panel. The heroes are also more likely to be paired off safely together.

About half the GLBT heroes are obscure, dead, or haven't appeared in years. The transgendered/bigendered characters are almost all MIA.

[manicr.livejournal.com]

I'm a bit torn when it comes to the issue of GLBT characters in marvel comics. Firstly I think it is nice that they exist at all and are allowed to be both heroes ad villains, however, since, as you pointed out, they tend to be marginalized or safely pair off if they are heroes and villainous if not, I get a bit miffed.

I'm a bisexual woman and it annoys me extra that most bi characters are either villains or former villains - the depraved bisexual trope is indeed in effect to a great degree. Don't get me wrong, I like my villains and I love Daken of all people, but it'd be nice to have some sane, nice and "good" depictions of bisexual people while still allowing them to get together, have sex and be happy on freakin' panel.

[harmonyangel.livejournal.com]

Re: the Rictor and Shatterstar categorizations, I think they may actually be reversed -- I don't think we can say Shatterstar is gay with how many women he keeps making out with/having implied sex with in X-Factor, and the way Rictor's been written there (though it hasn't been stated one way or the other), it's possible PAD is writing him as gay-but-in-denial-before.

[transemacabre.livejournal.com]

Good point! I always perceived Julio's feelings for Rahne as genuine, but he could be established as firmly gay at some point. Of course this is all provisional, as stories in the future could and probably will reveal things about various characters' sexualities.

[silverwhistle.livejournal.com]

think of all the lesbian vampires in film that appeared LONG before any lesbian could take center stage as a heroine

Yes. Interestingly, one of the first really good lesbian characters I can think of in literature is Countess Geschwitz in Wedekind's Lulu plays (1895-1904). She's devoted, brave, self-sacrificing (to the point I wanted to shake her for being a doormat to the manipulative Lulu): a good woman who falls for the wrong person. Just before she gets murdered, she's talking about wanting to go home to study law so she can fight for women's rights. It's particularly tragic, then, that she gets killed off.

[harlot-ohara.livejournal.com]

Maybe its a bit silly to be stuck on this but...Andreas von Strucker? I clearly stopped reading Thunderbolts too early into the run! When did that happen?

[transemacabre.livejournal.com]

Fabian Nicieza stayed that Andreas was bisexual, which much be the least shocking revelation of a character's sexuality in comics history.

[lokifan]

Thanks for doing this! *adds to memories*

Left Out and Misprint

[shatterblade01.livejournal.com]

I'm surprised that America Chavez is not on this list and as for Shatterstar and Rictor, it's flipped, Shatter is bi and Rictor is gay.

Re: Left Out and Misprint

[transemacabre.livejournal.com]

Did you not notice that this post is from 2011? America Chavez had only debuted a couple of months before I wrote this, and her sexuality wouldn't be revealed for some time. Rictor and Shatterstar's exact sexualities were also still debateable in 2011, it wasn't yet clear if one or the other or both were gay or bi.